Returning to Who We’re Made to Be

Transcript of a Sage Hill Live Fully Podcast conversation with Dr. Chip Dodd. Lightly edited for readability; speaker labels omitted.

This podcast is brought to you by Sage Hill, a social impact organization. Our mission is to help people be who they're made to be so that they can do what they're made to do. Find more resources to live fully, love deeply, and lead well at sagehillresources.com. Hi. This is Stephen James. Thank you for listening to the Live Fully podcast brought to you by Sage Hill Counseling and chipdodd.com. We're so glad you can be with us today as Chip and I continue our conversation about how to respond with an open heart and a loving posture in the world today under so much stress and so much uncertainty amidst the coronavirus and COVID nineteen pandemic that we're all living through together. If we can be of help to you in this time, please reach out to us at sage hill dot c o or chip dot com, and we are glad to engage you in a way that could help you, your organization, your family live fully, love deeply, and lead well in such trying times.

Hey, Chip. Hey, Stephen. How you doing? Man, I've had better days. You so so how how are you feeling since you've been sick? Oh, I'm feeling feeling much better physically, emotionally And I was in quarantine for my family down in the basement, and they were upstairs. And, it I was so lonely and so scared. I was just down here by myself all the time, especially from dinner on. I was, like, lonely, and I could hear them having fun and playing and, like, enjoying each other. And they were scared of me, and so that that was weird and hard for them. And it was very, very lonely. And the minute I got the negative COVID test result, I ran upstairs, holding my phone out, like, look, look, look. So excited. And Elijah ran up and mock hug me. Like, gave me a mock hug. And I I held on for dear life. Like, no. I want a real hug. I I emotionally, like, bounced back so quickly that I think it gave them whiplash. And then physically, I followed almost just as quickly. It was astounding to me how hungry I was for relationship.

And But you're telling me that you literally started feeling physically feeling better directly related to one diagnosis, a negative diagnosis, and then secondly, being in touch with your family again. Yeah. I think having yeah. I think I would have felt even better if I'd have gotten a a positive diagnosis because it would have removed the uncertainty. You know? But it it but the negative diagnosis certainly helped, but I think the relationship and the getting to participate, like, really brought me back quicker. You you I said something a minute ago, that that it's like being a ghost. You could hear them upstairs. They they knew to be afraid of you because if you they know you're down there making noises, they can't see you, you're invisible. You have the torment of not being able to be with them or touch them or be seen by them, and it's like like a ghost. Yep. And I wanna tell you something. That strikes me, with something that, I'm watching, and experiencing. And I think, potentially, a great opportunity we have with, this tragedy. And, What are you seeing, Chip? Well, I tell you what, one, I put out a couple of tweaks. I mean, there's definitely, it's time to face that we need to turn go ahead and face what has been distracting us from how we're made and get back to living how we're made, and that's god, others, self, self, others, god. Relationship with ourselves, others, God. Yeah. I mean, we're made for it. But here's the thing. Even as you talk about your, you know, your separation and your isolation, there's this there's this truth that we're made to experience and it's never gonna go away. And I think it's what's gonna create get us back to a, not a not not a normal, but for, a new normal for many. And I don't mean that life's never gonna be the same again. I think we can't help but attempt to make life the same again.

Right. But we will have a new normal. I think there there really may be, some real benefit from, I'm gonna use a word that, doesn't go over well a lot of times. But I think there's gonna be a lot of benefit from our isolation, a lot of benefit from, that repentance. Mhmm. And I I know it's a strange word, but, That's a great word because it means to turn back towards something, to return again to how we're made and who we're made for. Well, and then what I love about that, therefore, it means to come home. And it means to come to how we're made, to who we're made to be, whose we're made to be as in with, and then what we're made to do as this as the fourth movement. You know? And so, and so what I mean by repentance, which is revival. I mean, repentance leads to revival. And and so the new normal, it can really be what I'm about to say that that this this repentance and revival, leads us to, living for those people who step into this, living a truth. What we've been talking about for years and years and years, you know, you you you have to be seen from the inside out to be to be known. Right? To really be known. Right. We know that neuroscientifically now too. It's not just biblical. It's iatal, relational. It's neuroscientifically. We have to be seen from the inside out to be known. We have to be vulnerable to be touched, and then we have to be exposed to be changed. And I'm seeing a lot of people during this time onto and reaching out towards things that historically would have been considered, I'm not going there. It's too vulnerable, or I don't want people to know this because they they can mock me. I think we're getting a a kind of a neat reduction in the, let's say, a humbling of the rich young ruler in some ways. And I don't mean that on religious terms, but I'm saying, well, yeah, I kinda do too. But the comfort the comfortable

and the powerful. Yeah. You think about that rich means insulated, young means grandiose or invincible, and ruler means power. And so rich young ruler I mean, anyone who's sane right now in our society, who on some level sees themselves as truly insulated from what's happening, really is delusional. Delusional out of touch. In denial. And and and it doesn't mean we're not gonna be okay, but it's like this is a real wake up call to having to face what it's like being human. And if I may add very quickly, we're tragically, and as a whole population, living what what is actually part of how life is constructed is that we're powerless over, life's conditions, but we're not helpless. Right. And we we're having a real good dose of of facing that we are truly powerless over life's condition, and all of us as a group can admit that powerlessness and which renders us vulnerable.

Yeah. We can admit our our former lives, like our pre COVID lives, and we're all mostly about rhythms and structures that kept us from feeling vulnerable. It kept us feeling powerful and secure and confident. And and right now, we're so disoriented, that we're we're left a lot of times with just ourselves. You know? It's two I've got two thoughts. One is you've always been ahead of the curve. Right? You were talking about feelings before feelings were cool, and then you were talking about jettiness and vulnerability before that was cool. Like, almost so far ahead of the curve that, like, you know answer to the invisible audiobook before too. I don't if you did it. Right. Which which right. Which so actually, it would be a great lesson right now. The, so one, you had the curve, and I keep thinking you've been talking about pace for the last year, and the world has come to a halt. I love that. Right? So that's one. And then two is an anecdotal kind of practical thing. I was talking to a friend this morning, and they commented on how much they're loving not having all the scheduling crap for the kid. There's no sports. There's no school stuff. There's it's just the just what we need to get by and not the ancillary that we think we need to keep us busy or keep us successful or keep us on the right track. And my friend said, we're we're not gonna do sports again when when this is over. I said, I was, like, laughing. Right? Because I give them six weeks, and all of their kids are gonna be back in their sports, doing practices, doing dance, doing all the stuff that they do to stay busy, because all that's good stuff. Like, it's all good stuff. Right? And I think we're, we're fighting out the power of the communal right now in our isolation

I love it. In our family. Yeah. Let me say something about that too because the power of communal, we're finding the benefit of it right now. But you just said what's gonna happen, the power of communal is gonna return us back to the distractions that take us away from the main attraction. Yeah. I mean, you you your your friend is literally saying, you know what? Operally, the main thing I'm beginning to see is the main thing. You know, some that's from some movie or something. Love it. Love it. Love it. Yeah. But he he he he said that, you know what? These distractions have been taking me me away from the main attraction. And because, you know, tragedy has historically struck in small geographical areas or in individual homes Slowly. In some other place where the car wreck or alcoholism. And so, therefore, it's it's rarely communal. And this is communal enough that it can actually create a new normal that when we do get back to, let's say, where where where we can be distracted again, where we can run from our feelings, like, as a community, then there could be a group of people that can be forever benefited from this tragedy. Yes. You know, crisis means danger and opportunity. It's a yin yang. And, and and so we can literally start practicing, the being seen. We can feed our hearts through relationship, but but but actually being oddities in some ways.

Thanks for listening to the Live Fully podcast with Chip Dodd and Stephen James brought to you by Sage Hill Counseling and chipdodd.com. We're so glad that you could sit in on this conversation with us. As we look to the end of of what we're all going through, I wanna invite you. If you're a professional people helper, you can join Chip and myself in Nashville this fall, to be trained more fully in what it means to love people in a caring, compassionate, and strategic way by, being a participant in the Sage Hill training. It takes place over three weekends this fall where you and a cohort of other peer learners will be instructed in the spiritual root system and how to use it and be yourself, in loving other people to the fullness who they're made to be. So we look forward to you joining us in that. You can find out more about that at Sage Hill.co. And if you're not subscribed to the chip..com mailing list or the Sage Hill mailing list, please hop online and do that. We'd be glad to include you and, and not over inundate you with information and offerings that we have going on, but really try to encourage you what it means for you to be your best self in the world and to love others in it. Thank you. And here's the rest of, my conversation with Chip. We were we we started playing playing horse as a family at night. Basketball? Yeah. Well, some people call it basketball. We call it miss the basket because collectively, we suck. Like, the six of us the six of us can go maybe four or five rounds of shots and no one make a shot. Yeah.

I mean, even not even hit the rim? Well, we'll probably hit the out of the six of us, certainly one or two of us are hitting the rim. So it's not consistent. And then as it gets dark, like, I'll be really good until it starts getting dark and the floodlight's on. And then my old man eyes, I can't see. So I start I go from, like, you know, making ten, twelve in a row to not not being able to hit the backboard. Like, because it's so I've you know, it it's Yeah. It is it is so much fun. Like, we were having so much fun. We're trash talk I'm trash talking. Yeah. Of course you are. Yeah. We're we're winning, people having bad getting bad moods when they lose. I mean, it's so fun. I love it. Right? And, Steve, look at look at the beauty you you're describing, being seen, being vulnerable, being exposed.

Yeah. And and and and you know what? There we talk a lot about how a lot of the, you know, how do we deal with the kids and, you know, the the teenagers. And one thing that I've noticed while we're talking about like, you're like you said like you're 85, how we deal with the kids and the teenagers. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I you know, I gotta answer. Young the young people. But you you young people. All you young people. But but, Stephen, here's the coolest thing. We're talking about, you know, like, children's fears and parents' fears. But do you know there are a lot of children that are 100 okay right now with what's going on? Yeah. And do you know how come? Because their parents are at home and because the the the main thing is the main thing and there's bike riding and y'all shooting horse. I'm telling you, I've known you a long time and there's no way all six of you ever go out and shoot as a group with with with, you know, everybody Yeah. And then roll around the grass or whatever y'all do. I mean, unless you hurt somebody's skin for bedtime. I got sensitive skin. I can't roll on the grass. I'll break that. Or did who okay. Who ran inside after you heard him enough and said I'm done? Me. Me. Me.

I did. We we played two games last night. I won the first game, so I quit because I didn't wanna lose. So I just sat on the side and cheered people on. Well, you know wanna lose. So during this time, I guess some of our worst issues come out too. You know? I won't have some regrets. Absolutely. Absolutely. But, you know so, Stephen, like, honestly, some children are okay because they have a place to take their fears and people who are listening to them. And they they're they're in their the condition they were born to be in. They're being how they're made, who they're made to be, who's they're made to be, with whom. And they're doing what they're made to do called grow up with, with, with family around. Yeah. Well, speak for a minute a little bit about because I got a taste of it. So my heart is very empathetic towards the single people, the shut in people, the isolated people who don't have that family experience right now. Yeah. Divorce, single parent, you know, single young professional. I know a lot of young professionals that are breaking all kinds of rules right now because it's just so lonely being being alone at home. And, what would you say, that this rhythm is inviting them to, exposing in them? What are some tools too that they could have to get through the next few weeks, months?

Yeah. You know, they're about, you know, 85 directions we can go. So but but just so, like, like, like, so the direction I take here, just know that there's a circle coming back around the other way. I mean, you know, so but but this is the the same thing that's true for the people who, like, this family I described and the one you described, like, happy family that's handling crisis well. You know, there are also a a also a major population that's a long single, you know, the thank God there are people who are being merciful about rent right now and two hundreds of thousands of pounds of food are moving all over the country so that people are are able to find food through giving, caring. You know, I talked to the last time we had a podcast. It's time for the especially believers to take their fruit to market.

You know? Like, it's time Yeah. We talked about loving your neighbor and sharing Generosity. Mhmm. At the at the standard, not the exception. Yeah. So I think we're talking about, while while it's a great time that loneliness is our need for connection and relationship, genuine relationship. And so single, it's not that that's a a negative being single. No. You know, economic, difficulties, shut ins, being seen to allows us to be touched. Being vulnerable allows us to be known, and being exposed allows us to be changed. Make your needs known and also be interested in the needs of others. And that can be done through the same means we're using. Isn't it wonderful how this technology is is finally in many, many, many ways being used not to hide out, but allowing us to sort of cry out to make that comparison, you know. And so let your voices be heard using tech that top technology that's available. And this is a great opportunity not to run from the main attraction that that that distraction doesn't have to be, our our main thing. We can we can step away, repent, so to speak, step away from distraction into and come home to how we're made. And that means communicating with other people, who are in similar situations or reaching out with your needs. Sonia, since last time we talked, I think she's made 280 masks or something. Wow. And the word spreading that she's getting some up to New York City and also that, you know, next door to the the kids who parents have asked for them. Shit. It's like, I mean, just get in it. Just get in it instead of instead of unless you can't get in it and therefore address the needs of the people who can't. And at the same time, Stephen, you know, there are sadly, there there is a great attraction, a tragic attraction to isolation. But I mean, it's like we say the rich young rulers who's insulated but actually isolated or the person who will do anything to avoid anxiety or fear, whether it's the poor house or the rich house. Right. I mean, a person who's invested in isolation, they're not coming out. And hopelessness. Yeah. Yeah. So, I don't know how we got off on that. We're talking about just the the

the whether it's a a young professional or a single person or a or an older person who is isolated right now and doesn't have ready community and is not unless they give some older people, it's not safe for them to go out. Like, it's actually unsafe. And they were and I saw where they in California, they would tell if you're 60 not to go to the grocery store. They're interviewing this one guy, and he said, but I've gotta eat. You know? And it's it's just so scary and sad. And Yeah. I mean, that's that's the, back to what you're saying in the beginning, you know, moments collective moments where humanity is going through a similar struggle that reminds us and and invites us to remember who we are, how we're made, what we're made for. This is a really, really, really rare thing. I mean, it's a really rare occurrence. I mean, 09:11, for sure, with something like that. The assassination of Kennedy, the America, the the Challenger explosion in America. But I don't know from a global perspective. I've been looking. I can't find something where everybody and with the consciousness that we have and the collective consciousness, everybody knew we were going through the same thing at the same time. Like, that's a really, like, spiritual experience we're having now, whether it's personal spiritual or not. You know? And it's kind of gotten like, that idea has has been sitting heavy with me in a good way that that they're we're going through something together. And I my hope in that is that we as a as a, a people, the human race people, will come out the other side more connected and less divided. You know? We I mean, it's it's we'll leave the ding there because it made me sound great.

Well, yeah, we'll come out more connected than divided, which is not going to happen. I know. That's my hope. And and and, yeah, that's a beautiful hope. And it is this this is crisis, and therefore, this is opportunity. It's dangerous and it's opportunity. And that's what, you know, our hope is legitimate. And this is a great opportunity for exactly what you're saying to happen and that's gonna occur through, the discipline of admission. Yeah. I mean, as if we take this and let this move us into our lives that we haven't had this before, that we awaken daily admitting powerlessness over life. And and that we we live that which makes us unified. Which is the human struggle. Yeah. Yeah. The human struggle. And and like I say again, we have to be seen to be touched. We have to be vulnerable to be known. We have to be exposed to change. So I mean and that happens to relationship. So this is a great opportunity for us to, face that that we're all we're we're truly all in the same boat.

Man, Chip, I think that's a great place to stop right there. So I thank you all for joining us. So glad that we could get together and and have conversations about what it means to to live fully, love deeply, and lead well. Chip, what do you have going on that people need to connect to and could find you know, there's always chip.com, but are there any other podcast you're doing or anything else right now that Yeah. Yeah. I'm doing, with Instagram live with John Reddick tomorrow night and, trying it for the second time. I'm doing Facebook live with Dihati Lewis at, 10:00 in the mornings, RCST. And then Central Standard Time? Test tomorrow? That's April what? Thursday. April 9? Ninth. Something like that. This will probably come out after that, but people can probably go back and find that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And there'll be there'll be a link to that at probably your website.

No. I don't know. I'll I'll just I'll just put it on Facebook. Take have people, join me on Facebook. Just Facebook me. And also yeah. It does come up on my website. It sure does. So Facebook Chip Dot. Face Facebook Chip Dot. Be friends with Chip Dot on Facebook. Instagram too, Chip Dot two on Instagram. Stephen, I tell you what too. I really I really do wanna recommend that people download the audiobook app into the invisible now. I'm serious. Okay. Yeah. I'm serious now. If you're having trouble sleeping, no. No. No. It's good. It's good. And it's got it's got noise on it. And Well, we talked about story is a great story. And it's a great it's a great story for times like this, dude. Well, see, I'm I'm being very serious with it. We've talked about ahead of ahead of our time ahead of my time,

and this is for such a time as right now. I mean, it's it's it's it's here. It's crazy, post here even. But, so The world's speeding up or you're slowing down. What all are you doing? I have no clue, man. This is just throwing my schedule off like crazy. I know that, Janae Kennedy is starting some online parenting support groups right now that that we're trying to use the Parenting with Heart curriculum to create some online support for parents. That's exciting. Right? How do how do we use this technology to Yeah. Move beyond Nashville and and Murfreesboro and Brentwood. But Yeah. Which is wonderful. Oh, yeah. So I think that's that's worth knowing about. But I am actually enjoying not having too much going on right now. I'm trying to embrace that and on a walk today, I took a, I've been enjoying siesta and then we'll wrap up after this. Cause no one wants to hear about my nap schedule, but I've been, I've been enjoying siesta in the afternoons for about fifteen minutes, twenty minutes yesterday. I slipped in this. That was an hour and a half, and I woke up right before a 03:00 call, like, right before I had to be on a Zoom call. And it is like a miracle that I woke up and was able to get to the call, but apparently, I was tired. But I got a hammock on the back porch, and I'm just, it's I get myself I get myself rocking a little bit, and I just fall asleep. And, so that's been kind of the highlight of my my, quarantine is finding Siesta, which I I think we've there are other cultures that embrace that really well. Ours is at one, but I think it's gonna be mine.

I I'm telling you that there there are some good things we don't have to leave behind from this. What's that? Some things that we need to get we need to prayerfully get out of. Like, god, please. Yeah. And then and then receive the benefits. You know, every time there's something that, overwhelms us, you know, the old the old, old testament thing that that what evil intends for evil's sake, God intends for good. I mean, God is still with us like crazy. The world's a tough place. So we'll sign off. Thank you. Yes. Hey. Bless you, Chip. Thanks, man. Thanks, Stephen. See you later. Thanks for listening to the Sage Hill podcast with Stephen James and Chip Dodd. So glad you could be with us today. We hope that our conversation was an encouragement to you, and, we'll be praying for you and ask for your prayers for us as we walk in this world together with experience, strength, and hope.

This podcast is brought to you by Sage Hill, a social impact organization. Our mission is to help people be who they're made to be so that they can do what they're made to do. Find more resources to live fully, love deeply, and lead well at sagehillresources.com.